Climate change...

[vbo man]

Jeste li skeptik ili verujete da ljudska delatnost ima uticaja i da se mora neshto uraditi?
Kopenhagen? Mogu li se ishta dogovoriti a da ima ikakav znachaj u ovoj sferi?

[tarana]

smanjenje emisije košta. kol'ko će koga opaliti po džepu je stvar teških pregovora.
a opšti (pogrešan?) utisak je da vremena još ima.

[mercedes]

Prvo moraju da se dogovore hoce li biti sexa za dzabe.

[vbo man]

Ma nije da koshta , nego ne pitaj.Ali ce se predpostavljam morati neshto uraditi...ako nije vec i kasno.
Medjutim ovu shemu/zakon koju ovde guraju sa TRGOVINOM CO 2 ( za sada) ne uspeshe da je proture ( odbijeno u senatu nakon instantne smene lidera opozicije koji je bio sve dogovorio s vladom). Hteo Kevin ( PM) da ide u Kopenhagen da se duva kako smo mi prvi (?) to uveli.A kazu da smo mi ako ne najveci a ono medju prvim koji imaju najvecu emisiju ( kako se rachuna ne znam , dal po stanovniku ili sl.).
Kako god okrenesh svalice sve na krajnjeg potroshacha - na narod.Vec prete da ce struja biti skuplja 30 % ( a niko ne spominje da je vec u zadnjih par godina i bez toga otishla vishe od dva puta).

[vbo man]

Kako to mislish Mercedes? Pojasni pa da se i mi smejemo :lol:

[vbo man]

Evo upravo bio prilog o nekim Ruskim istrazivanjima oko ovoga...pomenushe izmedju ostalog porast infekcija i kako se moraju preduzeti mere za pojachanu zdravstvenu zashtitu.Ja sam taj porast bash primetila a o tome se jako malo pricha ( uglavnom o porastu nivoa mora , poplavama i sl. Chula sam da pominju kako ce u novim uslovima teshko da zashtite biljke ( posebno poljoprivredne) i kako ce se zivotinje seliti ( ovde kod nas se ochekuje da dodje ona otrovna meduza izmedju ostalih koje sada ima samo gore u tropima).Mozda i krokodili sidju ovamo nize. Ali slabo ko pricha o uticaju direktno na chovekovo zdravlje.

[Pijanista]

Cemu sluze one prakljace izmedju onih ventilatora pored puta?

[vbo man]

Nemam pojma :?:
Nisam sigurna odakle je ova slika ali mogla bih se kladiti da je negde iz Evrope.Kad u USA ( ili pribogu AU) budem videla jednu jedinuod ovih " vetrenjacha" tad ce mozda biti spremni za Kopenhagen. Tako da je mercedes u neku ruku u pravu...za sad mogu tamo da prichaju samo o seksu...naravno uz dobro vino i rakove...
A ovde se vrshe smene u rukovodstvima partija, izbori hoce da se zakazuju a sve toboze po ovom pitanju...

[Tromotorac]

Nemam pojma :?:
Nisam sigurna odakle je ova slika ali mogla bih se kladiti da je negde iz Evrope.Kad u USA ( ili pribogu AU) budem videla jednu jedinuod ovih " vetrenjacha" tad ce mozda biti spremni za Kopenhagen.

Palm Springs, CA:



Ima jos jedna Windmill farma... evo, nadjoh West Maui Forest Preserve - veoma novo, podignute u zadnjih godinu ipo dana, dakle mozda ce jos da dodaju.

[vbo man]

A pa lepo...to je za pohvalu...ima li josh negde? Tako velika zemlja...Mozda se ipak pomene u Kopenhagenu josh neshto osim seksa u tom sluchaju :mrgreen:

[Tromotorac]

Ima kol'ko ti dusa zeli. Mada, siguran sam da ce Dear Leader naci nacina da vam se izvini u ime drzave koju predstavlja, za nedovoljne rezultate prema vbo kriterijuma.

Da se ja pitam ne bi se uopste islo u Hopenhagen. Takodje, ja bih posadio 200 nuklearki, i betonirao travu...

[vbo man]

Da se ja pitam ne bi se uopste islo u Hopenhagen. Takodje, ja bih posadio 200 nuklearki, i betonirao travu...

Uh , uh , uh zaboga...

[mercedes]

Kako to mislish Mercedes? Pojasni pa da se i mi smejemo :lol:

Izgleda da su se ovi u Kopenhagenu uplasili jos veceg zagrijavanja pa su odlucili da svim ucesnicima posalju razglednicu sa pozdravom da se u toku konferencije uzdrze od kupovine seksa. E to je naljutilo ove sto od seksa zive pa su donjeli odluku da svim ucesnicima daju seks na poklon samo je uslov da pokazu ID da su ucesnici na konferenciji. Pise jos da stize 15 000 ucesnika + 5000 novinara, tako pise zuta stampa.

[vbo man]

E pa svashta :x

[Tužni Grad]

Da se ja pitam ne bi se uopste islo u Hopenhagen. Takodje, ja bih posadio 200 nuklearki, i betonirao travu...

Gume. Don't forget the gume.

VBO, čudi me kako se ovi vaši Jaostralci tek sad setiše certifikata za otpad, to je kod nas već uigrana šema. Em ovi mogu da emituju kako im volja, em da to regulišu oko poreza, a vlada može ušićarene pare da investira u trupe za Avganistan, kitorast bombone ili šta je već (narodu) aktuelno potrebno.

[vbo man]

E pa Tuzni ti si u Evropi a oni su mnogo "odgovorniji" i "progresivniji". O tome se i radi shto ta njihova trgovina sa CO2 ce biti samo jedan novi porez prevaljen na kraju na nas dole a da pri tom nece ni da se smanji emisija osim mozda neshto malo utoliko shto ce struja i sve ostalo biti papreno skupo pa cemo mozda malo manje da troshimo. Ma zanima me samo gde nalaze sve te ideje za pljachku xrotaeye

[Tromotorac]

I kad svi budemo bili u krpama i dronjcima, ziveci u zemljanim hut-ovima, nadnicarili subotom da otplatimo carbon-offset credits da bi nas pustili da stanemo u red nedeljom da napunimo kante sa vodom iz bunara,  i tad ce naci nacina da nas pljackaju, za sveopste dobro jelte. Zabrani vodu za njive da bi zastitili neke sitne zabe i ribe kojima bi evolucija ionako otkucala 12pm... Global warming my ass.

[D(z)avid]

Kako mogu vjerovati nekome, a ovdje mislim na svedskog premijera prije svih ostalih, koji se u javnosti iskida agitirajuci za "nalazenje rijesenja" i "jedinstvenost" na kopenhaskom samitu, a njegova je vlada prije koju sedmicu izglasala gradjenj jos jedne nuklearke ovdje u Svedskoj??!! Jos su pritiskali koalicijsku partiju da im da glas kako bi imali vecinu za nuklearku, partiju koja je tradicionalno "no-nuke" orijentacije (Center partiet)...

Inace, dok se ne natjeraju USA, Kina i Indija na redukciju zagadjivanja, od globalne prevencije nema nista, sve i da se svi ostali sloze oko "zajednicke" platforme. 

[vbo man]

Kina i Indija i sl. mogu da prestanu da proizvode kad drugi ( mi)  prestanu da troshe...Dokle god je tu svu robu toliko jeftinije praviti tamo i dok je po ovako niskim cenama troshice se. Prema tome sve shto ide u prilog smanjenju cena ( veca produktivnost itd) kontraproduktivno je ochuvanju zivotne sredine. Jedino shto bi pomoglo je neke nove manje opasne tehnologije.Zasad se tu ide mini koracima. A zashto? Pa verovatno shto jedna ekipa mora da se nenormalno nabogati na ovim resursima dok ih ima.Ta ista ekipa "placa" politichare i tako u krug.Ja nisam climate change sceptic...po onome shto vidim i chujem ( osim ako vec nismo skroz u 84-oj) a i osecam na kozi jasno je da se klima menja i da ce to doprineti promenama na planeti. Ne bezim od toga da se neshto mora uraditi ( pa cu dati i svoj skromni prilog tome) ali politicharima i njihovim shemama ne verujem uopshte.
Nuklerake ne mogu da smislim , ima toliko drugih nachina ( istina ne tako jeftinih i brzih al ko ih shisha , zashto uopshte sve to mora biti zasnovano na profitu?) ...Da smanjivo nivo potroshnje energije mnogo nije realno ochekivati...pa Kina i Indija su tek pochele da troshe.Da se smanji drastichno broj stanovnika na planeti nije realno ochekivati jer bi to morao biti atomski rat...Mada kad razmislim chini mi se da mnogo kasnimo ako smo i mogli shta da uradimo...Sve je povezano s ekonomijom i niko nece da se odrekne kolacha...nije ljudima generalno svest na visini...

[Tromotorac]

Vbo, mnogo olako prelazis preko tog "istina ne tako jeftinih i brzih al ko ih shisha , zashto uopshte sve to mora biti zasnovano na profitu?"
Hajde razmisli nasta ce liciti zivot kad ti racun za struju i svakog energenta bude 10x veci....  ili probaj da se setis nasta je licilo drustveno uredjenje koje je bilo usavrseno do te mere da je pomislilo da moze da eliminise "visak vrednosti/profit".....


Nuklearna energija je najcistija, najefikasnija i najbolje dugorocno resenje. Meni je neverovatno da je to sasvim prihvatljiva tehnologija izmedju Francuske i Japana; Rusija izvozi tu tehnologiju, Kuvajt i Saudijska Arabija se pripremaju da zidaju nuklearke - dakle svima je to prihvatljivo osim ovih anglosaksonskih treehugging self-hating placipicki kojima sta li je cilj, da se frizider napaja vetrenjacom?

[neprijateljska emigracija]

Nuklerake ne mogu da smislim , ima toliko drugih nachina

Nabroji jedan, pa se upitaj zasto se masovnije ne koristi.

[vbo man]

Ima stvari ( na zapadu a posebno u USA istina ne josh tako mnogo koje nisu u privatnim rukama) koje zbog velike vaznosti i uticaja koji mogu imati na celo chovechanstvo ( ili dato drushtvo- drzavu) ne treba da budu podvrgnute testu profitabilnosti. U zadnje vreme apsolutna privatizacija svega u USA ponajvishe dovela je do takvih devijacija kao shto je sluchaj iz 'Capitalism- love story" kad se sudija i tuzilac udruze poshto je chini mi se tuzilac sa josh nekim KUPIO popravni dom i osudjuju decu na po 11 meseci zatvora jer su opsovali ...otprilike.Od drzave su za to muzli milione. Uhvaceni su...shteta je napravljena.
Privatizacija vojske, zatvora , da ne pominjem zeleznicu , telekom i slichne trivijalnosti ... zbog pogane ljudske prirode i nemerljive grabezljivosti jednostavno ce drushtvo dovesti do totalne dekadencije. Naravno da trzishte treba da postoji i ne treba niposhto da bude NEREGULISANO pa time otvoreno za zlopupotrebe ali shta vidimo danas na tom trzishtu? Ukrupljavanje kapitala i monopole.  xuss Da li sam onda za to? Ne!
Da nisam na svojoj kozi osetila tu " levu" opciju verovatno bih danas bila levlje nego shto sam. Problem je shto ne verujem nikome vishe.Ni nauchnicima ( koja korumpirana bagra).Izgleda da apsolutno niko ne radi u korist chovechanstva.Valjda nam se zato i blizi kraj...

[Paramecijum]

Kažu da će u budućnosti superavioni prevoziti na dugačkim relacijama po nekoliko hiljada putnika odjednom. Biće to najjeftiniji način prekookeanskog putovanja; no, svaki put kada takav gigant zvekne, to će mnogo boleti.
Neke zemlje mogu bez nuklearki, neke ne mogu.
Srbija svakako može.
A podsećanja radi, pogledajte kako izgleda deo oko Černobilja iz ugla jedne Ruskinje koja je na motoru prokrstarila prostranstvima http://www.kiddofspeed.com/ Sajt je prilično haotičan, a pri dnu ima mnogo linkova koji nude svašta, treba se samo malo potruditi i skoncentrisati, šteta je ne videti sve.

Gradovi u kojima nema više nikoga i ničega:

[vbo man]

Kad su u pitanju nuklearke ja sam strogo protiv.One su disaster waiting to happen. Ne moze se imati poverenja da ce se one hendlovati kako treba ni kad su u drzavnom a kamoli kad su u privatnom vlasnishtvu. Kao u sluchaju Chernobila dakle ne treba da objashnjavam zashto ne mora biti dobro ni kad su drzavne ( drzave bankrotiraju takodje don't they?) a kad su u pitanju privatnici tu je pohlepa za profitom tolika da se ne moze nikom verovati.Mozda ako bi postojao zakon da vlasnik i njegova sva porodica moraju da zive u krugu nuklearke...mada pomahnitale horde profitera mozda ni za to ne bi marile.

[Daisy]

- quote -

In 2000, the German government, consisting of the SPD and Alliance '90/The Greens officially announced its intention to phase out the use of nuclear power. Jürgen Trittin, from the German Greens, as the Minister of Environment, Nature Conservation and Nuclear Safety, reached an agreement with energy companies on the gradual shut down of the country's nineteen nuclear power plants and a cessation of civil usage of nuclear power by 2020. This was enacted as the Nuclear Exit Law. Based on the calculation of 32 years as the usual time of operation for a nuclear power plant, the agreement precisely tells how much energy a power plant is allowed to produce before being closed down.

The power plants of Stade and Obrigheim were turned off on November 14, 2003, and May 11, 2005, respectively. The plants' dismantling is scheduled to begin in 2007.
...
By tightening safety regulations and increasing taxation, a faster end to nuclear power could have been forced.
...
In 2008, Merkel and the CDU shifted to open opposition to the phase-out, rejecting a compromise proposed by the SPD to postpone the shutdown while enacting a constitutional ban on new plants. For the duration of the grand coalition between the CDU and the SPD, the anti-nuclear policy remained in place. However, with the victory of the CDU/CSU and the FDP in the 2009 federal election, it is expected that the phase-out will be delayed or scrapped.

- end quote -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_power_in_Germany#Phase-out

[Tužni Grad]

Taj dismantling je džaba, jer je opštepoznato i naučno dokazano kako vek trajanja apsolutno svih radioaktivnih izotopa koji nastaju fisijom i fuzijom iznosi maksimalno 4-8 godina iliti jedna do dve legislativne periode (u zavisnosti od stranke na vlasti).

[vbo man]

Sad sam pochela da gledam Earth 2100

http://www.watch-movies-online.tv/movies/earth_2100/

Poludokumentarac

Deluje prilichno nauchno fantastichno ali pre svega zastrashujuce...

Da li nas samo plashe ovakvim kataklizmichnim prichama :shock:

[Ivan_D]

Climate change, global warming etc. all one big boo job (dok se ne pokaze suprotno i mozda bude kasno, hehe)

[Paramecijum]

Taj dismantling je džaba, jer je opštepoznato i naučno dokazano kako vek trajanja apsolutno svih radioaktivnih izotopa koji nastaju fisijom i fuzijom iznosi maksimalno 4-8 godina iliti jedna do dve legislativne periode (u zavisnosti od stranke na vlasti).

aha... da je sve baš tako, zar bi i dan danas ojačavali kovčeg oko reaktora i preduzimali sve mere opreza da spreče da radioaktivni materijal dospe na slobodu?

[Daisy]

Chernobyl radiation map 1996



Zone of alienation (wikipedia)








This is the final checkpoint. Protective radiation suits, a special permission are required beyond this point......I am not that curious.

Our Pyramids

The sarcophagus will remain radioactive for at least 100.000 years. The age for the pyramids of Egypt is 5,000 to 6,000 years. Each cultural epoch left something to humanity, something immortal, like Judaic epoch left us Bible, Greek culture- philosophy, Romans contributed law and we are leaving Sarcophagus, the construction that going to outlive all other signs of our epoch and may last longer then pyramids.

http://www.angelfire.com/extreme4/kiddofspeed/chapter10.html








Americium

Some of villages are heavily poisoned. The radiation here is even higher than it is near the reactor site.

If we take a Geiger counter reading on the road, then one on the grass and compare the two readings, the grass is 8.5 times more than the asphalt, because radiation becomes concentrated in living organisms. The source of this radiation is Americium.

http://www.angelfire.com/extreme4/kiddofspeed/chapter40.html






The Wolves Land

Usually, when they talk about the dead zone, they talk about area that is 30 kms around reactor.

What about this towns and villages? They are 60 kms from reactor.

The Wolves Land is bigger than many think and it keeps on growing. Now days, it spread on 300 kms from South to North and on 100 kms from East on West.

Of course, folks are still living in various places, but you won't find a young and prosperious people with happy faces. They are mostly elderly people who want to spend the rest of their lives in their old homeplace... Some places are clean and safe to live in, but the infrastructure of the region has collapsed and there are no jobs and nothing to attract young people anymore. The region is dying away.

http://www.angelfire.com/extreme4/kiddofspeed/chapter47.html

duzina 300 km je otprilike Beograd - Makedonija ili Novi Sad - Leskovac
sirina 100 km je otprilike Beograd - Loznica ili Beograd - Cacak ili Beograd - Jagodina

[Hate mail]

 :!:

by Bernardo_de_la_Paz December 7, 2009 2:47 AM EST

It's a fair question to ask if the Earth is heating or not. The science is certainly not settled on unambiguous on that topic. Since you apparently failed to read the many links I provided in a previous post regarding the numerous flaws in the global 'warming' data, I'll repost here:


The leaked CRU emails are just the tip of the iceberg. The fact that the CRU has 'lost' the original data after all these years of requests to provide it is much more damaging. The most damaging revelation though is that the climate modeling software they have been using is worthless junk. (That may be too kind; it may well have been deliberate fraud.) Check out the vast amount of discussion about the code going on in the blogosphere, for instance:

http://bishophill.squarespace.com/blog/2009/11/23/the-code.html

http://www.neuralnetwriter.cylo42.com/node/2421


BTW, the files appear to have been leaked, not hacked:


http://www.examiner.com/x-28973-Essex-County-Conservative-Examiner~y2009m11d21-Who-leaked-the-Hadley-CRU-files-and-why

At this point the UEA CRU contributions to climate science have been fully and completely discredited. Given the massive amount of incompetence and even apparent fraud that underlies their publications, nothing they have said can any longer be taken seriously.


As has often been quoted, the UEA CRU reports are one of the three principle elements used by the UN IPCC to reach its conclusions on climate change. One of the other three is the NASA GISS surface temperature data histories. However, that data is also in just as much if not even greater dispute than the UEA data. Regardless of what the quality of the analysis of the NASA data may be, the original data is now known to be of a highly dubious nature.

The NASA GISS relies of data collected from surface temperature monitoring stations since 1880. The problem is that those surface stations have been exposed to localized changes in temperature over the past century plus that has not been adequately accounted for. It is doubtful that the necessary corrections even could be accounted for. Here is a link to one effort to document the localized changes that have affected the temperature readings:

http://www.surfacestations.org/


As can be seen, even the US government agencies responsible for the source data have no effective record of the local changes that have occurred around their weather stations over the past century. For example, consider the thermometer station that is located five feet from a trash burn barrel - where is it recorded when that barrel was installed, when is the trash burned relative to when the thermometer is read, how much trash, for how long, and what type is burned each time, which direction and how fast is the wind blowing around the burn barrel and thermometer, etc. Now consider the multitude of questions about similar localized effects for all of the thermometer stations.

(It is likely that the UEA CRU temperature data contains the same flaws, but since the original data is conveniently 'lost' it can't be proven. It is clear from the discussions of the leaked UEA CRU modeling software that sorting out the past history of the temperature recording stations around the world is virtually impossible.)

Regardless of whatever fancy analysis is applied to arrive at the GISS conclusions, it is painfully obvious that the raw data is far too corrupted to draw any conclusions of global change. The very most that it can measure is the increasing urbanization of North America over the past century. On top of that, NASA has been forced to revise some of their most significant findings due to analysis errors:

http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=1142


Next, let's consider the so called paleoclimatology research. Much has been made about estimating ancient temperature trends by studying tree ring data. It turns out that research has also been fraudulent and incompetent:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/09/29/yamal_scandal/

In summary, the researchers picked just a tiny number of trees from Siberia to study, assumed that nothing other than global temperature trends could affect the growth of those trees, and worst of all eliminated the trees from their data that did not support their conclusions.


It is becoming clear that there are vast holes in the so-called science behind the global warming / climate change theories. Far from being a 'settled' science supported by uniform consensus, we see now that it is really a faith-based 'science' that it is more religion than science. I have immense respect for religions belief, but unfortunately for AGW believers they have based their faith on a certainty of scientific knowledge. Since science can be objectively tested, we are now seeing the core tenets of the church of global warming steamrolled flat by exposure to reality.


More in:

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/12/05/blogs/coopscorner/entry5905404.shtml

[Tromotorac]

Copenhagen Climate Summit spews More CO2 than30 countries in Entire Year Combined

[Pijanista]

A Rusi traze da im se u offset uzmu njihove tajge jer apsorbuju CO2... Sou

[Tromotorac]

Copenhagen climate summit: 1,200 limos, 140 private planes and caviar wedges

[Hate mail]

Warming, Aliens, Zombies... Sasvim legitimno.  :mrgreen:

[vbo man]

Ma ne znam ali mnogo je vruce ovde...ne izlazimo iz bazena mi srecnici koji nemoramo (josh) da radimo :mrgreen:
Cela ova godina...brate vruca.Ako nastavi ovako pojavice se krokodili ne samo ovde u Brizbiju nego i u Beogradu xrofl

[vbo man]

Danas ni bazen ne pomaze...voda vruca.A ni erkon ako se krecesh.Javishe bash danas da je ova 2009 druga ili treca godina po vrucini odkad beleze a ova druga polovina u Australiji najtoplija od kad prate. Bio talas vrucine u Adelaidu sa onako jedno dve nedelje preko 40 a u Viktoriji zabelezena najveca temperatura ikad od skoro 49 stepeni. Vatre gore na sve strane a oluje i poplave ne jenjavaju uvek negde po Australiji.U WA nisu videli poshtenu kishu ne secaju se.Climate change ? Ma kakvi xrotaeye.
U Americi kazu ankete pokazale da sve manje ljudi veruje u climate change ili se uopshte brine o tome.Sa unemploymentom od 10% and rising oni i ne misle o nichemu drugom.
Ovi u Kopenhagenu se ludo zabavljaju a oni muchenici sa raznoraznih ostrva koja ce da nestanu kolko sutra hoce da napuste konferenciju i kazu nece da potpishu te gluposti...Divota. Anyway nauchnici poruchuju da je i onako kasno i da se bolje pripremimo za ono shto stize.Kako cemo?

[D(z)avid]

Citiram iz "Metroa" (onaj besplatan news-casopis sto se dijeli inter-kontinentalno, pogodan za blic-citanje u bus-u, metrou itd.), svedsko izdanje:

"Prema najnovijim istrazivanjima, koja izmedju ostalog sadrze mjerenje ugljik-dioksida u atmosferi, "najzeleniji" grad u Evropi je Kopenhagen, zatim slijede Stokholm, Oslo i Bec. Najzagadjeniji su istocno-evropski gradovi, medju kojima je prvi Kijev, zatim dolaze Bukurest i Beograd."

[Pijanista]

Zajebi CO2, reci gde ima najvise metana, to je gori gas.

[D(z)avid]

Neam pojma, mozda bude u sutrasnjem "Metrou", a onda ce te biti blagovremeno obavjesteni... :mrgreen:

[Pijanista]

Odokatvino, ta gde ima pasulja ima i metana  :mrgreen:

[D(z)avid]

 :mrgreen:
Vojvodina!
Bolje onda da se cijepe!

[Pijanista]

Slaba vajda, vetar ne poznaje granice.

[iDemo]

High Drama In Copenhagen:

[vbo man]

Copenhagen climate summit in disarray after 'Danish text' leak

    Developing countries react furiously to leaked draft agreement that would hand more power to rich nations, sideline the UN's negotiating role and abandon the Kyoto protocol

    The UN Copenhagen climate talks are in disarray today after developing countries reacted furiously to leaked documents that show world leaders will next week be asked to sign an agreement that hands more power to rich countries and sidelines the UN's role in all future climate change negotiations.

    The document is also being interpreted by developing countries as setting unequal limits on per capita carbon emissions for developed and developing countries in 2050; meaning that people in rich countries would be permitted to emit nearly twice as much under the proposals.

    The so-called Danish text, a secret draft agreement worked on by a group of individuals known as "the circle of commitment" – but understood to include the UK, US and Denmark – has only been shown to a handful of countries since it was finalised this week.
    [...]

Komentari Evropljana su :

Seems like standard negotiating tactics to me.

Leak something outrageous, and then "compromise".

Inexperience and incompetence were never the real problems. The real problem has always been that the Danish government is populated by poodles and Quislings who will sell their own country and their own continent down the river to please their American masters.

You didn't actually expect anything substantive did you ? Too many vested interests, too many powerful deep-pocketed lobby groups, the US Senate, India, Australia. Heck the saudis want to be compensated for the reduction in oil extraction resulting from electric cars !!! This is  not a serious meeting and there is no chance of serious reduction.

Sea levels will have to rise sufficiently to drown major cities before the global politic comfort zone shifts, by which time it will be far too late.

[iDemo]

Sea levels will have to rise sufficiently to drown major cities before the global politic comfort zone shifts, by which time it will be far too late.

Evo i ja sam kupio shlauf... Vidim da (vise) nema zezanja.

[vbo man]

 xtwak
Shta ima ti da kupujesh shlauf kad si daleko od obale :mrgreen:

[iDemo]

xtwak
Shta ima ti da kupujesh shlauf kad si daleko od obale :mrgreen:

Pa on kad kaze 'major cities' misli na Kanberu, znas...  xyxy

[Daisy]

КОПЕНХАГЕН, КОНФЕРЕНЦИЈА О КЛИМИ - Светски лидери су до касно у ноћ разматрали могућности заустављања глобалног климатског поремећаја (Фото АФП)

[vbo man]

Sve je to cirkus tamo u Kopenhagenu...navlache se oko love...kao da pa neshto mogu/hoce/znaju da urade xuzi